President Obama: "I'm frustrated"
President Obama speaking at Johnson Controls Inc. in Holland, MI yesterday. (CNN/Lesa Jansen)
August 12th, 2011
08:51 AM ET

President Obama: "I'm frustrated"

During his speech at a battery facility in Holland, MI yesterday, President Obama blamed the political climate in Washington for the weak U.S. economy. He called on congress to pass bills to help create jobs, and just as he did during the debt ceiling debate two weeks ago, he called on Americans to push their elected officials to get to work.

Obama even got a little emotional, saying that the audience could probably here the frustration in his voice, and that's because Washington is now suffering from the "worst kind of partisanship" and the "worst kind of gridlock."

Here's how the folks over at CNN Wires described the event:

(CNN) - Declaring himself frustrated with political fighting in Congress, President Barack Obama on Thursday blamed some of the nation's continuing economic troubles on government inaction and urged Americans to tell their elected representatives in Washington to pass bills that will create jobs.

In an energetic speech to workers at a Holland, Michigan, hybrid car battery plant helped by government stimulus funds, Obama said the U.S. economy and American workers are capable of being the best in the world, but were being held back by political stalemate in Congress.

"There is nothing wrong with our country. There is something wrong with our politics," Obama declared to applause.

Last week's first-ever downgrade of the U.S. credit rating by Standard & Poor's "could have been entirely avoided if there had been a willingness to compromise in Congress," the president said, adding: "It didn't happen because we didn't have the capacity to pay our bills. It happened because Washington doesn't have the capacity to come together and get things done."

"You hear it my voice. I'm frustrated," Obama said, referring to what he called the "worst kind of partisanship" and the "worst kind of gridlock" in Congress.

While Obama called on Democrats and Republicans to put the welfare of the country ahead of partisan gains, his comments appeared aimed at GOP opponents accused by Democrats of pursuing a narrow political agenda in the House and stalling progress in the Senate.

Citing "things we can do right now to accelerate job growth," Obama complained that "the only thing keeping us back is our politics."

He called for Congress to immediately approve measures that he said were "ready to go," such as a payroll tax cut extension, a road construction bill and free trade agreements with South Korea, Colombia and Panama.

"The only thing preventing these bills from being passed is the refusal of some in Congress to put country ahead of party," Obama said.

He called on people to tell their senators and Congress members to "stop sending out press releases, start passing bills," adding: "They've got to hear from you."

Obama also promised more proposals in coming weeks intended to stimulate job growth, but he acknowledged that Congress also has to address mounting federal budget deficits.

The debt ceiling agreement passed by Congress last week and signed by Obama cuts government spending by more than $900 billion and creates a special congressional committee to work out another $1.5 trillion in deficit reduction steps.

Despite the agreement, the subsequent S&P downgrade and global economic instability has caused wild fluctuations on Wall Street this week.

Repeating his call for a comprehensive approach to deficit reduction, Obama said the country needs to continue investing in education, clean energy and other vital areas while also ensuring that entitlement benefits for senior citizens are protected. That means a balanced approach to deficit reduction in which wealthy corporations and individuals are paying their fair share toward a solution, he said to applause.
"Everybody's got to chip in," he said. "That's fair. You learn it in kindergarten."

It was Obama's second visit to Holland, an emerging hub for hybrid car battery technology. Until recently, it was best known for sugar-white Lake Michigan beaches and its annual tulip festival.

Obama toured a Johnson Controls-Saft plant that was built with a $299 million grant from his administration's 2009 economic stimulus program and now expects to employ 500 people when fully operational.

Before the speech, Obama got some good news when the Labor Department reported the number of first-time filers for unemployment benefits fell last week, dipping below 400,000 for the first time in four months. The figure of 395,000 beat economists' forecasts of 409,000, according to consensus estimates from

"It's a good sign," said Brett Ryan, U.S. economist with Deutsche Bank. "The trend in claims is going to be one of the most important things we watch over the next few weeks or so, to gauge whether we're entering another recession."

However, the unemployment rate remains above 9%, and Obama's visit to Holland was intended to highlight his job-creation policies.

Both Johnson and Korea's LG Chem have built battery plants in Holland. LG Chem received $150 million from the American Reinvestment and Recovery Act, and Obama appeared at the groundbreaking of its 200-worker plant in 2010.

LG employee Shane Vander Jagt told CNN that the plant's future was "very bright."

"This technology is not a fad," said the 34-year-old Vander Jagt, who said he has been laid off "more than once" in the past few years. "It's only going to grow."

Holland, a city of 34,000 located 30 miles southeast of Grand Rapids, had an unemployment rate of 13.2% in July 2009. It's currently 9%.

Even without stimulus funds as an enticement, the area has been drawing other players in the industry. Switzerland-based fortu PowerCell is building an advanced battery plant in Muskegon, 30 miles north of Holland - a decision company spokeswoman Deb Muchmore called "good common sense."

Michigan "is the automotive capital of the world," Muchmore said. "Its work force is manufacturing-savvy (and has) tremendous expertise with all things mobility."

Muskegon's unemployment rate peaked at 15.7% in July 2009, and it was hit again by the 2010 closure of a paper mill that added hundreds more to the unemployment rolls. By June 2011, that figure had fallen to 10.8%.

Topics: Economy • President Obama

soundoff (188 Responses)
  1. Cameron Newman

    You see? THIS is the sign of a good president. Yet the conservatives, and conservative media will through all of the blame his way. He shows a fiery rage filled passion for fixing the U.S., and that he's literally throwing his heart, soul, and personal well-being into everything he can, in order to turn things around. Yet the bipartisanship of congress, continues to spread as much bullshit and unwanted decisions about as they can, with no regard to what the PEOPLE (that make this country exist and function) want and know they need. Thank you, Mr. President. You're doing all you possibly can to right the, almost insane, abundance of wrongs being thrown your way. I just hope the people will use there brains, like they seldom do, and understand that you really are here, representing us. Unlike the majority of the current political system.

    August 12, 2011 at 9:30 am |
    • Cindy

      I don't want what he wants...I'm frustrated because he provides no leadership. Mr. Obama is very partisan ...he favors one side clearly over the other and blames everything on them.

      August 12, 2011 at 11:42 am |
      • jean2009

        @Cindy be specific where is he partisan. Supply facts...figures, dates, footnotes.

        You don't want what he wants? PLEASE! Do I take that to mean you don't want jobs for unemployed people? I think he has provided great leadership....even against the odds of those who have made it their sole purpose. in life, to obstruct every good thing he tries to do.

        So, just put these facts in your bonnet. In the year 2008 (who was President in 2008 GWB) 2.6 million jobs were lost, the economy went into the toilet, home foreclosures mounted, the stock market crashed, TARP was enacted to bailout banks, and the auto industry was bailed-out, all before the end of 2008, and I might add before President Obama took office. All due to the mismanagement of the last Administration. The Administration that took a balanced budget and a surplus from President Clinton, and squandered it on tax breaks for the wealthy and two unfunded wars.

        Do you realized that failed Administration and the goons who holler socialist every time health care is mentioned...actually wrote the Iraqi's Constitution for them and supplied them $950Million of our American taxpayer's money to fund universal health care for all Iraqi's. If you don't believe me read Article 31 of the Iraqi Constitution. Pure hypocrisy, when they call Americans who want our health system to work for everyone "socialist"; when they themselves insured that the Iraqi's would have universal government funded health care... with our tax dollars.

        I don't think it partisan to blame those who are totally responsible for this mess.....who do you think we should blame the tooth fairy?

        Stop sipping the poison tea get over whining, and say something factual.

        August 12, 2011 at 7:02 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        No Matter what she meant you will take it any way you want to ... .that has become very evident

        August 17, 2011 at 12:08 am |
    • Rosie

      Never mind, I have no words that will suffice.

      September 2, 2011 at 9:19 pm |
  2. DavePrice

    Obama has 3 things in congress he states will help the economy including a renewal of a tax cut for middle class with payrolls! If this do-nothing congress cant even get that passed we need to vote in Congressmen that will work together.. Tparty is proving they are NOT doing anything that they promise.

    Obama needs to come up with more stuff OTHER than thowing money at problems.. lets bring our boys home, Iraq was a disaster of nothing but LIES and Bin Laden is dead and we never said we owed Afghanstan anything, we where at war.. war is over, GET OUT and come home.. geez, who is this Obama?? its not the guy i voted for?

    August 12, 2011 at 9:33 am |
    • jean2009

      You better re-read the Vietnam war and how long it takes to get troops out safely...and sometimes that doesn't even work. Getting into a war is a lot simpler than safely removing men and arms when shutting a war down.

      Do you actually think the Rethugliklan committee of 6 are going to let him cut off those military industrial arms sellers? They won't think one second about cutting veteran's benefits...but Halliburton...Halliburton is a big money supporter of the Teaparty.

      August 12, 2011 at 7:09 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Most eveybody has heard this so much that all they can hear now is blah blah blah blah..... youo are a broken record...

        August 15, 2011 at 1:16 am |
      • jean2009 look who's talking.....Mr. Negativity...

        FYI information in any lexicon "spade" is a racial slur.
        Typing: "Is spade a racist term" in the search engine returns about 1,300,000 hits

        And don't give me that Greek gibberish. You and I both know this is not Greece, and you and your buddies in white sheets haven't all of a sudden learned fluent Greek...all you have learned is how to be crude racist.

        August 15, 2011 at 4:29 am |
      • Bill in STL

        It goes like this you racist idiot... The information gleaned was from a reputable source .... you declined to accept reuptable sources found on the internet ... you declined to accept the fact that as I said ... here is a cut and paste....

        in typical liberal fashion you decline to advertise what this was all about and spin it to your benefit. In typical liberal fashion, when I chose to ignore you for the ignorant racist person you really are.... you ran screaming to carry this to another reply of mine.

        Now once and for all .....the term call a spade a spade is not racist. It has nothing to do with that ....

        For alll that are here and seeing this woman make a fool of herself ... please google the phrase .....

        It is not all about you jean ... or you either liz ...

        I am sure you will rant and rave about this ..... but you know what .... I don't care anymore;. Racists like you are simply incapable of accepting that you might be wrong.....

        August 16, 2011 at 8:18 pm |
  3. Really?

    Not half as frustrated as WE are with YOU, Obama!

    August 12, 2011 at 10:10 am |
    • Michael

      Really? You have got to get over the fact your people elected a bright educated black man. Think for a change. I can understand how you can't understand how the majority of people elected this man and why you can't understand that when you stomp your feet, no one really cares. It time you actually learned to be positive instead of the constant 'negatives' in your life, but I've learned that when stupid people learn to use the word "no" they find it easier than expanding their vocabulary by 50% to three letters by saying "yes" on occasion.

      August 12, 2011 at 12:07 pm |
      • jean2009


        August 12, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        And what you libs have top understand is that some of us don't agree with his policies ..... yet you keep harping on rethuglikans (ala jean earlier on) and neo cons, and racists (ala Liz).... I simply don't agree with this administrations policies ... thats all... and you know what .... thats okay, or at least it is supposed to be in the America I grew up in...

        August 15, 2011 at 1:18 am |
      • jean2009

        @ Bill we would understand if you could state one policy clearly without all the racial slurs and unimpressive lack of supporting facts.

        August 15, 2011 at 4:59 am |
      • Bill in STL

        So now jean ... you seem to think that I should state my policies all over again? YOU are challenging me on that ... you won't even admit that you are wrong when YOU ARE.....

        This is not Greece that is your assumption .... and surely it is not the Greece of Pericles.... which is where the roots of the statement are found. SO .... My adivice to you is Sit down take a chill pill and try to eliminate the stress of being the center of the universe....

        August 16, 2011 at 8:22 pm |
  4. Forrest

    He is frustrated? He is frustrated. Oh seriously this is horrible, he is not getting what he wants out of congress so he is playing on the ignorant viewpoint of that congress should be acting and passing bills ( without reading them ). That is what happened with the Health Care bill which may have parts ruled unconstitutional ( we will know in what another 3 to 5 years lol, ah the swift wheels of justice )

    Look I suppose I am different than most people, I view more laws, more regulation, more government intrusion as a bad thing. I like gridlock in congress as it proves that no one idea or ideal is simply going to be rammed through without a thorough vetting of the concept. To be honest I am very sad the budget and debt ceiling bill passed as I feel it is is a shame. I know you can debate that with me, I welcome the debate as the exchange of ideas may actually make me change my mind. Let me explain my position and then you can tell me where I am wrong.

    The balanced approach that Obama is talking about was already calculated into CBO projections, which assumed the expiration of ALL Bush tax cuts in 2012 and a gradual winding down of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. The bill that came out of congress did not 'cut' anything it slowed the possible growth of a handful of increases in spending. Now for the real problem. I know I am picking a 'bad year' but to be honest it is the last full year I have data on from the IRS. In 2009 we made as a nation $7.65 Trillion in Personal ( Household ) Income.

    Now compare this to the year 2000 where Clinton paid down the Debt where we as a Nation made $6.35 Trillion dollars in income. In 2000 the expenses of the Federal Government was $1.79 Trillion in 2009 the expenses where $3.5 Trillion.

    Forgive me if perhaps I am stating the obvious here but if your expense double and your income does not then you may be increasing the rate at which you are spending money more quickly than what you are bringing in. Just a guess on my part. Also no matter how you look at it the 'Bush' tax cuts are not responsible for an increased rate of outlays to that extent. Even under the 'Clinton' tax rates we would have had to have made as a nation $12.5 Trillion dollars to be able to afford the 'benefits' that we are spending on a Federal level.

    Now I do not believe that Government can fix the economic system but I do believe that it can get in the way of economic prosperity. It does so mainly through over regulating industry, and that so far has been all Obama has done. So I am happy for a little gridlock there. I also simply wanted to point out that wealth creation is the main vehicle in which this country grows and becomes more viable. I know it is easy to hate the rich, it is easy to say they do not deserve what they have and how horrible it is to be at the bottom and look up and be envious of what they have.

    I am tired of Obama's partisan attitude, I am tired of his blaming of the state of the economy on others, oh it should be, but man up, own what is occurring and take action to fix it. If there is a bi partisan way to fix the economy than why is he sitting around and complaining about the fact that for the FIRST TIME IN HIS PRESIDENCY he has had to compromise and he dislikes it. What did he accomplish that 'helped' the economy in his first two years of presidency. Please keep your tone civil and I will enjoy a spirited debate on this topic.

    August 12, 2011 at 10:26 am |
    • Bruce

      "The balanced approach that Obama is talking about was already calculated into CBO projections, which assumed the expiration of ALL Bush tax cuts in 2012 and a gradual winding down of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan."

      This doesn't get enough air time. All cuts to the deficit will be measured against the assumption that we have Clinton-era tax rates in place. Any extension or making-permanent of any portion of those tax cuts will actually increase the deficit and need to be answered with that much more in spending cuts...

      August 12, 2011 at 1:10 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        There is nothing balance about his approach... when you tell the other party no ... that is not balanced... you have not even heard what they have to say and you judge them ... that will be the legacy of this president.

        August 15, 2011 at 1:20 am |
    • isaac


      August 14, 2011 at 8:03 pm |
  5. Mike Crampton

    Our President is the "All Time Greatest Campaigner". Unfortunately he is the United States "All Time Worst President in History". (Jimmy Carter says "Wheww") Here he is blaming everyone but himself for his poor performance. Fortunately, he is doing this buck passing in front of a Union crowd, otherwise he would be booo'ed off the stage. This guy offered up hope and change, all he returned to those who entrusted their support and dollars with him was more campaign slogans, blaming, vanity, absence of leadership and insecurity. This guy never had a real job, knows nothing about economics, negotiating, true cooperation or respect for those around or under him. He's an empty suit and I think Hillary should challenge him in 2012.
    May God Bless America

    August 12, 2011 at 10:34 am |
    • jean2009

      Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush the worst of my 76 years.

      August 15, 2011 at 5:00 am |
      • joe

        Obama the worst american Disaster since 9/11

        August 18, 2011 at 12:47 pm |
      • TOM TOM

        Barry never should have been president. He is not a leader. This is what you get when you elect a commie pinko community organizer. Now we all have to suffer under his whinny crying. This guy needs a baby bottle to shut him up.

        September 1, 2011 at 3:35 pm |
  6. sonny chapman

    Repubs. hate Obama more than their self-professed love of America.

    August 12, 2011 at 11:22 am |
    • Cindy

      Why does everyone blame it on a Republican if the President is criticized? What happened to freedom of speech?

      August 12, 2011 at 11:44 am |
      • sshh

        what about when bush was president and you guys all stomped your feet about how bad he was, we all have the right to have our own beliefs and speak them.. plus its pretty clear that he is the worst president and has worse approval ratings then bush ever did.. its not about democrat or republican its about being a good president and im moderate.. GO RON PAUL

        August 12, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
      • jean2009

        Because facts are facts and history has dates. George W. Bush was at the wheel when the American economic bus went off the cliff.

        August 15, 2011 at 5:02 am |
      • Bill in STL

        Especially whne jean states them.... it does not matter if they are true or not.

        August 17, 2011 at 12:10 am |
    • maikl

      To Sonny: Where yours Yes we can and change? He is the worse president ever. Don't you see it? He is small communist agitator.

      August 12, 2011 at 12:37 pm |
      • sonny chapman

        The only Communists left in the world are in N. Korea. Need to come up w/another hate filled word to describe the Perz.

        August 12, 2011 at 12:47 pm |
      • C-Lo

        Sonny–you mean like Nazi? (don't know that there are any of them "left in the world")

        August 12, 2011 at 1:34 pm |
      • jean2009

        @ C-Lo...Wrong! Loads of websites waving Swastikas about 7.5 million hits. The Neo-Nazi movement is alive and well in the United States.

        August 13, 2011 at 4:17 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Once again Sonny ... a shinning example if liberal intellegence... N. Korea? Try adding China, Cuba, and once Hugo is doen Venezuela.... We won't be far behind though

        August 15, 2011 at 1:22 am |
      • C-Lo

        Jean–my point exactly–just like there are commies that are alive and well, one happens to be running the white house. Any of you who don't like these "characterizations" please see GW Bush criticizm circa 200-2008.

        August 15, 2011 at 12:32 pm |
      • jgn

        I don't know why I read blogs, I just want to get the pulse of the american people as a whole.....I see a country so divided.... reminiscent of the years preceding the civil war...... A good man was elected my the majority of the American voters to try to bring the USA into the 21st century. a man trying to make America the shinning star, she once was. But so many folks can't see, read, comprehend what President Obama is trying to do..... From what I read, folks who are very religious seem to think a black man is the devil and therefore is taking the USA to hell i.e. communism, born in kenya, muslim, and any other garbage they can throw. I am praying and hoping that they can start reasoning with the brain they were given and see how negativity destroys all – everything.....And start finding common ground that we can all use to make our country great again

        August 27, 2011 at 11:06 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      What can you expect from a person that really is so far out oftouch with the world that he thinks there is only one communist nation left on this earth! You are so wrong.... any one that loves America as much as I do will fight to allow you to be that ignorant.... and happy

      August 15, 2011 at 1:25 am |
  7. Liz Carter in Georgia

    @MsP; I hope you'll see this. I'd like to thank you for your post on August 2, 2011, 9:04 am ET on the perpetual ill-mannered, disrespectful, sabatoging, demeaning shenanigans that are purposely and meticulously waged against the President; anything he attempts to do or say; whether it is in reference to his performance in the Office of the President or his own personal/family life. I'm like you; I've never seen another US President treated with this much vitriol, insubordination and dismissiveness! Ever!!

    August 12, 2011 at 12:22 pm |
    • sonny chapman

      Liz, hate is a powerful emotion. It causes those who can't shake it to lose all powers of reasoning.

      August 12, 2011 at 12:49 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        as demonstraed by Liz's post.

        August 15, 2011 at 1:26 am |
    • maikl


      August 12, 2011 at 1:20 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      In my past dealing with Liz ... Racism is the first thing she cries.... This is the firts Black President and Liz has become the kings chanpion in this case ... slaying dragons where none exist.... It will be impossible to debate iether Liz or jean on the points of policy of this administration.... they feel they have to protect him first and formost ... and if you happen to disagree with the current administration ... then you are racist.... get used to og maikil

      August 14, 2011 at 7:03 pm |
  8. Bruce

    Mr. President, the buck stops with you. Sure, you're frustrated that the GOP is acting like a bunch of ninnies. This is new since when, exactly? Seriously, stop blaming McConnell and Boehner and the Tea Party for the inability of Washington to govern. Why are you letting them act like ninnies? Why do they have such power over you, while the most effective tools of the executive lie unused in your toolbox?

    Why can't you manage, when you get people like McConnell and Boehner and Reid and Pelosi in the same room with you and you close the door, to come out a little bit later with five people who go out and get things done?

    If Boehner and McConnell are truly lost-causes, why is it you can't side-step them and find 7 or 8 moderate Republicans in the Senate, and 30-40 moderate Republicans in the House, to agree with you on what needs to be done? Are you THAT unpersuasive, is your leadership THAT ineffective, that you can't manage to convince a tiny minority of Republican legislators to transcend their petty partisan politics just long enough to get something done?

    Just so you remember, you had a window of time where you had a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate and a solid majority in the House, and do you remember what you did with that opportunity? You squandered it, you couldn't even keep Nelson and Liebermann in line, you let Kennedy's seat go empty and then to the GOP, you let a Republican fill Franken's seat for far too many months, you gutted all progressive reform from the health care reform law, and in the end you had to play procedural tricks to get it passed because for some reason you couldn't get that done before you lost your filibuster-proof majority. If you were going to ram HCR down the throats of the GOP with "budget reconciliation" anyway, why didn't you at least keep the public option intact?

    And why didn't you get a progressive budget, with progressive tax reform that got rid of tax cuts for the rich, plus a progressive jobs bill (e.g. a huge national infrastructure project like the New Deal), passed in that same time when HCR was being debated? Can't you walk and chew gum at the same time?

    Seriously, now. I'm a progressive and I recognize that all this "frustration" you are having is just whining and making excuses for your lack of leadership and your lack of ability to get things done. In 2008 we handed you the keys to the kingdom, and you squandered a precious opportunity.

    Why a credible progressive is not rising to challenge the President either in the primaries or cultivating a progressive third-party candidacy is beyond me. Well, not beyond me. Apparently progressivism is dead, and President Obama killed it...

    August 12, 2011 at 12:36 pm |
    • sonny chapman

      One of the "Changes" Obama sought to bring w/him to Washington, was the ability for people of different political philosophies to come together & come up w/solutions to common problems. That is one of his core beliefs. It's in his DNA. The hope is that we, as a country, would come to realize our ability to work together w/those who we disagree with. Call him naive, but Obama's still striving for that goal.

      August 12, 2011 at 12:54 pm |
      • Bruce

        That's fine, sonny. It's an admirable goal. But he's failing to achieve that goal.

        I'm not accusing him of having bad intentions. I'm accusing him of failing to get things done.

        August 12, 2011 at 1:12 pm |
      • Bruce

        Oh, and sonny, remember that after the 2006 mid-term elections, a GOP President had to deal with a Democratic House and a divided government. There was a lot of partisan bickering and small-minded politicking going on back then between 2007 and 2008 and that's what President Obama sought to change.

        So, just in terms of partisanship and the political climate in Washington–this big "goal" that Obama said he had from day one, are we better off or worse off today than we were when GWB was in office? I'd argue that it's worse now than it was then. Therefore, this President has not only failed to achieve that goal, but things have gotten much worse with respect to that specific goal.

        Is it his fault? Maybe not entirely. Is it his failure? Definitely. The buck stops with him.

        August 12, 2011 at 1:21 pm |
      • jean2009

        @Bruce what really disturbs you is that he does get things done.
        Like Health Care Reform, like getting Osama bin Laden, like DADT...without all the obstructionist he could get a lot more done. As for infrastructure the Bush Administration left it in a child left behind a failure both in application and in rotting schools, roads, bridges, water systems, levies, you name it, left to rot until they break down or collapse.

        August 12, 2011 at 7:51 pm |
      • jean2009

        @Bruce – From 1995 to 2006 the Republicans controlled the Senate, and from 2007 to 2009 it was evenly split 49 Republicans and 49 Democrats and 2 independents. From 1995 to 2006 the Republicans controlled the House of Representatives...anything the Democrats could get through the House from 2006 to 2008 was not going to make it through the Senate which was deadlocked.

        Nice try, but your facts don't fit the situation in either body.

        Political divisions of congress.

        August 12, 2011 at 8:09 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        And you can't achieve that goal by always saying no, or having your minions Harry and back the Nancy do it.

        August 15, 2011 at 1:28 am |
    • Bruce

      Sometimes I wish the President would call McConnell's bluff. Senator McConnell said, at the end of 2010 just after the elections, that his #1 legislative priority for the next 2 years was to make Obama a one-term President.

      So here's how the President calls his bluff: he gets McConnell alone in a room, and asks him, "what would you give me today if I agreed to not run for reelection?" Then he gets something BIG from McConnell, like a New New Deal, and announces after he signs the bill into law that he's not seeking reelection.

      Then a REAL progressive or two could come up and start a solid debate on the future of the Democratic Party and the future of the country, and we'd have a really interesting Democratic primary season that would make the GOP primaries look silly.

      One can dream...

      August 12, 2011 at 1:57 pm |
      • sonny chapman

        That would require a total suspension of political reality on all sides. What is achievable though, is what Obama the Community Organizer saw in real life. People at political war with each other could & did come together to reach a rational solution to a mutual problem. Immediately after the 2008 Election, Repubs. were faced with a delimna: Appear to cooperate w/Obama & get the best deal they could on the issues OR fight him head on about everything & try to win back the White House in 2012. Rush Limbaugh gave the attack order,"I want Obama to fail". Jim DeMint joined in, "Health Care will be his Waterloo". McConnel fell in later, "We need to make him a One-Termer". If the electorate had punished this tactic, maybe we wouldn't have the blind hatred we now see.

        August 12, 2011 at 2:26 pm |
      • Bruce

        Now, sonny, you blame the "electorate" for what happened. Stop making excuses for this President. He's failed.

        I don't doubt he had solid intentions. I don't doubt he really believed he could pull some of this off. But he didn't pull it off.

        Call a spade a spade. The President is a failure.

        Will any of the GOP candidates do any better? My guess is no, they will not. They will likely do much worse. That fact doesn't take away from the failure of this President.

        If you try your hardest to hit the ball crossing the plate, and you miss each time, on the third strike you are out. It doesn't matter how hard you tried, that your intention was to get a hit or at least to get on base (even if you had to get hit by the pitch to do so), that you practiced many hours and days before this–you're out.

        Time for the next batter. Enough already.

        August 12, 2011 at 2:41 pm |
      • jean2009

        I wouldn't trust Mitch McConnell to not throw grandma under the bus. Why do you think the President should believe he would keep a promise?

        August 12, 2011 at 7:28 pm |
      • jean2009

        Your racial slur "spade" remark is very telling about who you really are.

        August 12, 2011 at 7:30 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Jean that saying has been around longer than you have .... It is not and was not intended to be racist .... So I will rephrase it for you ... call a diamond and diamond.... It means to that you have to label something correctly.. You can't call a volks wagon a cadillac as and example.... YOUR comment on the other hand is very telling about who you are!

        August 14, 2011 at 7:05 pm |
  9. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Yes, President Obama! From where I've been sitting, you would've been excused to be 'frustrated' long before now! I think you've done excellently with staying above the fray and continuing to stay on the 'high road'; but there's come a time when you have to acknowledge what's REALLY going on and what's seething at the root of your frustration! I hope you know by now, it's not just about your politics; i.e., deficit, debt ceiling, debt, healthcare, etc. Most of it's aimed at your blackness! Stay Strong MAN!

    August 12, 2011 at 12:53 pm |
    • sonny chapman

      He is a lightening rod for Right Wing vitriol hate, but so was Hillary before him & even "Bubba" Bill before her. Jesus said, "If the world hates you, realize that it hated me first". John 15,18.

      August 12, 2011 at 1:00 pm |
      • C-Lo

        And the leftist show SO much compassion, love and understanding of Bush, Palin, Bachmann et al. While I appreciate your "sensitivity" to bringing down the level of "vitriol" you may want to try another Bible passage and remove the plank from your own eye before pointing out the sliver in another's.

        August 12, 2011 at 1:40 pm |
      • Jay in NC

        And we all know how much Liberals love conservatives. I am still waiting for H. Clinton to apologize for saying her husbands indiscretions were a 'Right-wing conspiracy.'

        August 12, 2011 at 1:41 pm |
      • jean2009

        They gave that same vitriol to Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, John Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson, Jimmy Carter...that is their trade mark, to wrap themselves up in a flag, thump a bible, and rant.

        August 12, 2011 at 7:23 pm |
      • jean2009

        @Jay you can hold your breath...but that isn't going to happen. They tried from day one with a non-existent White Water and every other ruse which was funded by some of the same money funding the Teaparty. The money behind trying to bring down President Clinton was Richard Mellon Scaife, and he and the Koch Brothers are the major funding for the Teaparty.

        "What Hell Hath the Tea Party Wrought?

        August 12, 2011 at 7:44 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      and this is how mediocriity was born... once you dumb the people down and get them to the poing that you can tell them what to think you struggle for complete power is over.

      August 15, 2011 at 1:31 am |
  10. Josh

    The rich are already paying their fair share, about 50% of the total tax revenue. How about we have everyone, especially the 47% not paying Federal taxes, jump in the game and pay their fair share too (Flat Tax)? Mr. President, if you are really serious about helping the economy, stop gallivanting around the country making empty speeches and get back to Washington and do your job!

    August 12, 2011 at 1:01 pm |
    • jean2009

      No to a flat tax, it only hurts the lower wage scale earners.

      August 12, 2011 at 7:17 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        So .... let me get this straight jean ... you want to reward mediocre people and crucify the rich on your cross of taxes? That is called the re-distribution of wealth.... Not a very tempting carrot there to ger people to take a chance and create jobs... Perhaps you want everyone to be employeed by the government... Oh and did you see the usps wants to drop government benefits as well as laying off 120 k... so that is not really secure either .... way to go Obama Team!

        August 15, 2011 at 1:35 am |
  11. Rick McDaniel

    My word, would be "fiscally irresponsible".

    August 12, 2011 at 1:09 pm |
  12. C-Lo

    He "...urged Americans to tell their elected representatives in Washington to pass bills that will create jobs." Yet when the elected representatives attempted this time and again, he declaired he would veto any of those bills that crossed his desk, then blames the Republicans for the gridlock. Kenyon Ken is the the most devisive person in DC and hides behind the uneducated masses that elected him, allowing the continued hate to spew from his supporters.

    Dem's created this mess in the first place–2 years of full control and what do we have? Record deficits, a "health care" bill that will sink this country, and not only continuing wars he campaigned to end, but jumping in the middle of more conflicts. Who has benefited from Obamacare? Adding taxes for 4 years before any outlays. I'd like 10 years to pay 6 years' worth of bills too. I'm sure I could easily balance my household budget that way.

    So after all of these problems, the American people started damage control in 2010 and NOW he wants to work together? Writing is on the wall. I'd rather see Joe the Plumber than another term of Kenyon Ken.

    Colin Powell, David Petraeus 2012! Bring real leadership to DC.

    August 12, 2011 at 1:29 pm |
    • Bruce

      "Yet when the elected representatives attempted [to pass bills that will create jobs] time and again, he declaired he would veto any of those bills that crossed his desk, then blames the Republicans for the gridlock."

      Well, to be fair, lowering tax rates and gutting regulation doesn't create jobs–or if it does, it creates minimum-wage jobs at McDonald's and telemarketing companies. (By the end of 2012, however, there might be many people lining up and waiting with bated breath for their opportunity to harass their fellow man when they sit down for dinner, for a wage that doesn't cover the bills.)

      That said, giving people who already have jobs a few extra dollars in each paycheck does not create jobs, either. It just makes Social Security and Medicare appear insolvent when they weren't before the tax holiday. These people were spending money they didn't have before the recession (e.g. refinancing their home), so a few extra dollars in their paychecks won't give them any more money to spend at the end of the day.

      August 12, 2011 at 1:37 pm |
      • C-Lo

        Don't worry Bruce. My calendar says by the end of 2012 we won't need jobs anyway 🙂 But seriously, full disclosure I would consider myself a Tea Party sympathizer, believing that we need to endure serious pain across the board to bring things back into perspective. I don't agree with the hardline position of not raising taxes, but if they want to raise taxes, they need to show me a LOT more fiscal responsibility than they have. "he who is responsible with a little shall be given much, but he who is irresponsible with much shall be given little" I didn't and still don't agree with a lot of Bush's policies either. Medicare D was just another big gov't take over.

        August 12, 2011 at 1:50 pm |
      • C-Lo

        By the way, Bruce...I know you and I will differ heavily on philosophies, but I appreciate most of your actually try to make sensible arguments, misguided though they may be, and refrain from the personal attacks.

        August 12, 2011 at 1:56 pm |
      • Bruce

        To be honest, C-Lo, I'm not sure we disagree as much as you might think.

        I do agree with Progressive/Keynesian economic theories that deficit spending by the federal government, if spent in the right places (like public infrastructure–roads, railroads, sewers, electric power, etc.), increases GDP growth and solves pretty much every fiscal problem we can think of. I also agree that we can engage in deficit spending pretty much indefinitely as long as, over tens of years, average deficit spending doesn't exceed average GDP growth.

        I'm also beginning to come to a similar conclusion as you seem to hint at, that perhaps perpetual GDP growth forever and ever is not sustainable, and moreover not desirable in the long-run, and that we should as a country and as a world try to throttle back, and over the coming decades make our economic goals to be a sustainable 0.0% GDP growth (which would necessitate a balanced federal budget). I'm open to those sorts of arguments, but precious few people on the right are actually talking about them, and most are calling for the same GDP growth that the left wants.

        But thanks for the compliment, C-Lo. 🙂 I try to be even-handed, even if I won't apologize for being an actual true-life Progressive. 🙂

        August 12, 2011 at 2:07 pm |
      • C-Lo

        I think your right that we are not as far apart as I first thought. That means one of three things:
        1. You are not revealing your true wants from government
        2. You are not really a "progressive" but actually a moderate (maybe even moderately conservative); or
        3. Others who claim the "progressive" title are really left wing nutjobs who diminish that word as much as the rightwing wacos degrade "conservative." Of course that doesn't sell papers, does it?

        Anyway, I'm sure this conversation isn't stimulating for the trolls out there. before i sign off, I'd recommend a book "Web of Debt" if you haven't already read it. Think you'd like it. Too "progressive" for me.

        August 12, 2011 at 2:27 pm |
      • Forrest


        I understand the idea behind Keynesian Economics and have to admit they worked great in a closed system ( or much more closed system ) however we now have a new economic infrastructure to deal with. Infrastructure spending does not actually generate wealth unless it is on infrastructure that is needed. In other words I can create great GDP by creating jobs to a million people that dig a huge trench in the ground and then pay them to fill it in, however that infrastructure does not actually produce anything of value. The same is true with most Keynesian economic avenues that have been taken.

        The funny thing is that Telemarketing is actually worth twice what an 'infrastructure' job is worth which is simply funny that you even brought it up. It is bothersome, however it produces ( well produced ) wealth that was viable and typically ( though it changed once the DO Not Call laws went into effect ) done inside the United States. Heck most telemarketers that are still in the US still make between $15 and $25 an hour ( I am in the telecommunications business and know a few companies that still do it to their customers ) and it is simply a way for small and mid sized businesses to actually communicate that they have product available on a one on one transaction. Most of that is now done now door to door but there are fewer people doing it because the ROI is smaller ( where you could pay $15 dollars an hour for an agent on the phone and get a $16 dollar return you can only afford to pay $10 an hour to get someone at the door to get $11 in return ).

        This is in point part of the problem is while telemarketing 'bothered' people it was a way to make the economy move and generate fiscal acceleration with product and service that people 'wanted' if no one wanted it it would have been fiscally nonviable and therefore it would have stopped without regulation.

        Now the main problem with regulation is it actually makes it harder for small business to enter into market ( regulation costs money to overcome ) Take telemarketing before the Do Not Call Law, register as a telemarketer and you could start calling people. Now in order to even get started you have to pay $50,000 a year just to get the list of the people you can't call. Not to mention the fact that you can't call a large portion of your target market who ( if they knew you existed ) would actually purchase your product at a healthy rate. So yes I would also say that deregulation provides opportunity to actually create wealth.

        Finally Social Programs. Social Programs are both Keynesian in concept and due to the small funding of their nature parasitic in practice. They grow more rapidly than the economy ( typically ) and have an unfortunate side effect of damaging people and their sense of social responsibility. They do help people, please do not think I criticize that in the least, I simply feel that the help they create is in equal portion to the damage they wage on people.

        Now and let me throw this out at you. Many people argue for the raising of minimum wage as a means to create wealth. Along with Keynesian economic theory this actually does the opposite, it damages the poor and creates competition for resources and hurts economic viability. Go back to the door to door position ( taking the place of the telemarketer ) the person now has to work for less in order to make the same amount of profit ( $1,00 ) if you raise minimum wage above what an employer can 'make' then they can no longer afford to employ that person. So if Minimum wage is more than $11.00 an hour then no employment will be possible.

        Anyway, just some thoughts on my end. I am sure I am not seeing something somewhere correctly, please if you can explain where and how I am incorrect I am more than happy to revise and edit my opinion.

        August 12, 2011 at 2:35 pm |
      • Bruce

        Forrest, I'm not sure we view "infrastructure" in the same way. I'm talking about the kinds of things that enable or even encourage economic activity, such as roads without too many potholes that a consumer drives upon to get to the store and shelves at the store that are not empty because the local police force has effectively deterred criminals from rampant looting. I guess the telephone network fits within that definition because it enables something like telemarketing, but telemarketing itself is not infrastructure, rather it is a business that relies on infrastructure to exist.

        If a business cannot profit by selling its goods on the phone, for whatever reason, it will stop selling its goods on the phone. If it cannot find somewhere else to sell those goods, it will probably go out of business. But this is true of any sales channel, whether it be renting a retail space or harassing people on the phone at dinnertime or deploying a website or hiring a sales company to do a combination of things available to them.

        I mentioned telemarketing not because it's not a valid sales channel, only because the $15/hour you might get out of it will not cover the bills in many places (depending on your circumstances–surely a young single person in the midwest would be happy with $15k/year working 20 hours a week because the telemarketing company refuses to hire full-time workers so they can avoid providing benefits like medical and dental), and even when it does cover the bills that doesn't save your soul from the evil that is telemarketing (of course that might be a little bit of bias on my part).

        Not sure if that clears anything up.

        August 12, 2011 at 3:00 pm |
      • Forrest


        No actually we are on the same page, and lets take your example of creating Telecommunications, the infrastructure already exists, in point of fact most of the infrastructure of the United States already exists in a significant amount that any additional spending on a majority of it simply creates redundancy ( the who point about hiring ditch diggers that produce nothing )

        Now lets take the idea of regulation, which I was making with telemarketing, you have an infrastructure but you limit business on the road, Business is in the end what you are attempting to create with any infrastructure project.
        If a business cannot profit by selling its goods on the phone, for whatever reason, it will stop selling its goods on the phone. If it cannot find somewhere else to sell those goods, it will probably go out of business. But this is true of any sales channel, whether it be renting a retail space or harassing people on the phone at dinnertime or deploying a website or hiring a sales company to do a combination of things available to them.

        Also most of the companies I know of that do telemarketing pay between $30,000.00 and $42,500.00 per year full time plus benefits just fyi. Oh I know some that are min wage and min benefits but those are typically for entry market kids who have NO skill sets. Yes I do think you are a bit biased on your part against telemarketers, but hey who really cares as I am a programmer lol.

        Now back to what I was poorly attempting to explain. In the end Keynesian economics does not work and infrastructure, cannot be of value as an economic incentive barring it produce something of value to create MORE wealth than what is currently available. Second, government OVER regulation ( rules MUST exist ) cause otherwise viable methods of wealth creation and the jobs that they WOULD have created to dry up. Both Democrats and Republicans do this fairly regularly for whatever various reasons or public outcry there is at the time. Now it almost always opens up more avenues for a select few ( lawyers, bureaucrats, etc ) to then leach or graft of these new regulations but rarely actually creates anything of value. Other companies with enough resources and revenue can absorb the cost of new regulation ( a telemarketing company that existed before the Do Not Call Law ) however it creates a barrier to entry that others cannot overcome. This in turn hurts new start ups which in turn means less competition and a more difficult time creating new wealth.

        A great example of this is the 'new' regulation that banks now deal with. the existing big boys love it as it makes entry to the market more difficult for up and coming banks. It is not all that taxing on them as they have the fiscal resources to handle it, and to be honest they were the ones in danger of losing their shirts ( not John Q Public ) so they don't mind complying as they were going to need to change course anyway.

        perhaps I have better explained myself, maybe not, thank you for keeping things civil as I dislike people who simply name call and are done with it rather than actually enter a discourse with substance. Hey even if I am wrong I may still learn something!

        I mentioned telemarketing not because it's not a valid sales channel, only because the $15/hour you might get out of it will not cover the bills in many places (depending on your circumstances–surely a young single person in the midwest would be happy with $15k/year working 20 hours a week because the telemarketing company refuses to hire full-time workers so they can avoid providing benefits like medical and dental), and even when it does cover the bills that doesn't save your soul from the evil that is telemarketing (of course that might be a little bit of bias on my part).

        Not sure if that clears anything up.

        August 12, 2011 at 3:14 pm |
      • Bruce

        Forrest, I think one thing you may be missing is that infrastructure not only enables and encourages economic activity through roads, bridges, police forces, traffic lights, power lines, telephone lines, etc., but infrastructure JOBS (people who build and maintain the roads, police officers, traffic engineers, etc.) create a consumer base that actually goes out and buys stuff, which increases economic activity.

        It's similar to Henry Ford who realized that once he started paying his factory workers a nice solid wage, he found that his workers became an important part of his customer base and increased the sales of his product. (Speaking of cars, how lucrative would the car manufacturing and car sales industry be without the interstate highway system?)

        I'm not talking about building bridges to nowhere or roads that are not needed or electric power generation and transmission that exceeds power demand just for the sake of employing people (but even that would not be a terrible thing in the long run). There is plenty of infrastructure work to be done right now because we are so far behind on regular maintenance, such as trimming the trees near already-existing high-voltage transmission lines so they don't cause the entire Northeast US to go into a blackout when they cause system faults.

        I understand your concern about overdoing it, but there is a lot to be done before we get anywhere near that level in terms of infrastructure.

        I also understand your concern for over-regulation, but as so-often happens in discussions like this, one side takes the truth of "over-regulation is de-stimulative to GDP growth" and pretends that all regulation is over-regulation and that the answer to everything is to hack and slash regulation willy-nilly. I think there is certainly room for regulation reform right now, and that it would help the economy. That said, I think many people dramatically overestimate the efficacy of deregulation in terms of stimulating GDP growth and creating jobs.

        August 12, 2011 at 3:40 pm |
      • Forrest


        Oh no you are correct that hiring people to create infrastructure creates jobs in the short term. From that it creates a demand that is much better than simply paying them to stay unemployed, which is what some have suggested as the best way to stimulate the economy.

        Again my fear and problem is not with creating a road to no where when it comes to infrastructure, rather that the infrastructure for the most part has been created and the amount of infrastructure projects that we can implement that will add value to the nation is limited. Again you bring up Ford. Lets look at Ford then. Ford was creating a new product that only 10 to 20% of the population had, yet there was a high demand for it. Second, because of efficiency gains he was able to pay high wages, even then many skilled engineers left his company because they did not enjoy being treated like machines ( much like your hated telemarketers lol ) however the wages often allowed people to disregard this issue. Lastly Ford was a Supply Sider, he created a product and then attempted to create so much of that product that it actually pushed the cost of that product down in comparison to other products of the same type ( if you build it they will come mentality )

        Now speaking of cars, I am not railing against the past creation of infrastructure to create wealth in a country that has a solid economic base in manufacturing. In point of fact I think that is sound and reliable Keynesian economic principle that is still viable in a country that has that. We do not. The infrastructure has been built at best we can put spit and polish on it and unfortunately the money that is generated from that employment then goes to where the real productivity resides, which is the manufactured cheap goods that we can no longer compete in the creation of.

        That is that whole if I have to pay a wage above what I get in revenue then I cannot produce it mentality.

        You see everything you said is correct but no longer applies to us as a nation as what we create, what we produce, is no longer possible to be produced competitively with the rest of the world. Infrastructure will provide us with a short term boost ( which is what we have seen from late 2009 to early 2011 ) but does not fix the fundamental problems of real wealth creation.

        Regulation, I would have to say that I am more optimistic that deregulation of MANY industries would create a great deal of wealth and wealth creation. I actually think that removing the Do Not Call lists would probably encourage about $500 Billion within the first year or two of its lifting. Of course I may well be wrong but I see tremendous profit in a relatively cheap and personal communication set. The internet is not all that it is cracked up to be and the main people reaping the benefits are Google, Bing, and Facebook, which is great but imagine if the US passed a law saying you could only have one ad per website page. Things would get bad REALLY quickly for them and soon the internet would become a worse economic vehicle for communication then it is. But again that is my point about regulation. Rather than letting things work themselves out Government gets involved and often ( not always as there are many GOOD kinds of regulation ) messes with things that would work themselves out in the end.

        Now I know we have enumerated the situation and I know you believe infrastructure is the solution and 70 years ago I would have agreed with you whole heatedly. In fact I don't think I would have paused for a second to say, lets do it!

        Things are very different now. So here are my suggestions and please feel free to debate them with me.

        1 ) open up a great deal of land for energy and mining exploration. Fuel is not only needed for cheaper gas and petrol products like plastic and other things, but we need to secure large quantities of rare earths in order to compete on the electronics and 'green' technologies that use VERY dirty and hard to find minerals in order to exist. This would allow a useful set of monies in infrastructure to be needed as well!

        2) Get rid of some of the laws limiting Telemarketing ( I know you hate that lol ) as it is an easy industry to open up again and get some market driven products moving at a cheap overall cost to contact consumers. I would also suggest the elimination of many laws and regulations that revolve around a great deal of advertising activities.

        3) Cut back the minimum wage law – now I know this seems wrong and that people will be unable to make a 'living wage' but the truth is again that by increasing the minimum wage we have been shunting much of our manufacturing out of the United States. We will not be able to bring EVERYONE up to our standard of living as fast as we may like and until everywhere is where we are, well we are going to continue to lose manufacturing. Minimum wage is one of the great lies told to an economically understanding challenged society. If all we had to do was raise minimum wage and everything would be better then we could raise it and have economic prosperity, that is not how it works, we have to deal with it.

        4 ) Invest in supply side creation. The sad truth is Trickle down economics works. Look at Clinton, the only time he was able to pay down the debt was when the rich made more than ANY OTHER TIME IN HISTORY in comparison to their fellow man. We need the Rich to be making $4 Trillion a year the middle Class to be making $6 Trillion and the bottom to be bringing in close to $2.5 Trillion. That is close to where Clinton was in 2000 in today's term.

        5 ) Did I mention deregulate lol.... Get rid of many of the laws that keep business from entering the market place, or at least create exemptions until they reach a certain size of sales a year.

        August 12, 2011 at 5:03 pm |
  13. veteran

    To all of masses of people who support THE TEA PARTY. I paid my dues and millions of others fighting serving our country. If tea party takes over it will be much worse , President Obama should overide the house of congress " TO ALL THE TEA PARTY PEOPLE HEAR THIS: YOU ARE IN THE SPOTLIGHT NOW " THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WILL NOT TOLERATE YOU ANY MORE.

    August 12, 2011 at 1:30 pm |
    • jean2009

      Hi Vet...thanks for your service, and thank you for your comment.

      August 12, 2011 at 7:14 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      Thanks for your service as well... But I do have a question... are you saying that conservatives are not American People? As a veteran how can you think that?

      August 15, 2011 at 1:36 am |
      • jean2009

        No dear me...didn't McCain call you all Hobbits? That was a little off.....Gollum.Morgoth!

        August 15, 2011 at 4:43 am |
      • Bill in STL

        He called the tea party hobbits ... get it straight.... I am neither republican or democrate and I bash both equally ... I am hoverer conservative ... and that is enough in your mind to condem me to the fires of down below forever

        August 16, 2011 at 8:26 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Jean, why do you presume that you can answer for veteran???? Ego problem there or are you the sole source of knowledge on the planet?

        August 17, 2011 at 12:14 am |
  14. Frustrated 2

    Before all you Obama supporters get in a huff, the Congress, the President, and the past 40 years of politics are the total cause of this mess. If they would work for the people instead of for their own petty greed, the United States would of been a whole lot better off. When apresident tells me, to tighten my belt, then he goes and plays golf and his wife flies to Spain to go shopping. What does that tell the average American who is out of work? We need leaders, not people telling us do what I say and not what I do. I am frustrated enough to ask Canada for asylum due to political incompetency.

    August 12, 2011 at 1:34 pm |
  15. Haneef Shakur

    @Liz Carter... I tend to agrre with you on your post. "They" may have voted for Obama to become President but there are people in this country who are willing to destroy the whole system of government, bring down the whole financial institution, let people starve to death, go homeless, have no medical care, etc.. before they allow Obama succeed. We have had some horrible Presidents in the pass and not ONCE has America's credit rating faltered.What the hell is that about? You saw that mentality with the 10 to 1 vote in the Rebublican debate last night. Mr. Presifdent you are going to have to play hard ball with them and stand on your principles as they are.. God bless you..and America cause we sho' gonna need it!

    August 12, 2011 at 1:49 pm |
    • jean2009

      Thank you I agree...there is some serious evil money out there at work against this president, and anyone who agrees with him. They do not mean the American people of any color well ... only the greedy corporations and those they can brainwash to do their biding.

      August 12, 2011 at 8:16 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Here we go again .... "THE MONIED POWERS" Blech

        August 15, 2011 at 1:38 am |
      • jean2009

        But true.

        August 15, 2011 at 4:51 am |
      • Bill in STL

        You seem to think that the only people with money are conservatives..... LMAO ... what a trip

        August 17, 2011 at 12:15 am |
  16. MTATL67

    I'd be beyond frustrated. If the man can bring all the factions of the auto industry together and get them to agree on new stadards. He has got talent. The GOP leadership chose to work with the President on any and all issues. It is there "No to everything policy" and is pure 100% spite.

    August 12, 2011 at 1:55 pm |
    • jean2009

      No look up the Koch Brothers and Robert Mellon Scaife, and their ilk.

      August 12, 2011 at 8:18 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        One side again Jean... take a look at James Carville

        August 15, 2011 at 1:38 am |
      • jean2009

        James Carville is not the Koch Brothers or Richard Mellon Scaife.

        August 15, 2011 at 4:50 am |
      • Bill in STL

        you are right .... He is a wealthy liberal.... there fore not evil ... by definition

        August 16, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
  17. drogo, the stallion that mounts the world

    Cooperation and rationality obviously don't work with most Republicans even though they proclaim their undying love of America. Time to start knocking some heads together on both sides of the political spectrum. Obama is the president of the United States, not California, New Mexico or the 1st congressional district of some state – president of the entire country.

    Time for leadership. You've made all the speeches. There's nothing more to say. Now is the time for action.

    August 12, 2011 at 2:02 pm |
    • jean2009

      The problem is they don't love Americans who are not wealthy.

      August 12, 2011 at 8:20 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        You think libs do.???? they all remind me of door to door insurance salesmen!

        August 17, 2011 at 12:17 am |
  18. sonny chapman

    Frustrated doesn't mean he's quit trying. He's trying to focus the electorate on the other side of the equation, the Repubs., to put pressure on them to start meeting him somewhere( the Repub. Prez Candidates even tuned down a 10 to 1 deal on taxes to cuts last night !) Obama's never dying efforts to try & reach some degree of cooperation may be rewarded by the American Voters by Reelection !

    August 12, 2011 at 3:25 pm |
  19. Ray E. Georgia

    I am frustrated too. And I will be frustrated until I see that 14.5 Trillion Dollar Federal Debt going the other direction! How about it Obama? Extend the Bush Tax Cuts for another 10 years, at least, so small business will hire again.

    August 12, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • jean2009

      They didn't hire the last time...why should anyone believe them now?

      August 12, 2011 at 8:23 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        Simple, because there is no clear leadership .... No one knows what the next rabbit pulled out of the administraitions hat will be.

        August 15, 2011 at 1:40 am |
  20. Liz Carter in Georgia

    @Maikl; I'm truly sorry that you get sick and tired of reading my posts. However, I know exactly how you must feel. I feel the same way about your perfect record of LOUD, stupidity.... 'WHERE IS YES WE CAN AND CHANGE'? It seems to be a plenty of 'CHANGE' going on! Why do you think you all are raising so much HELL? 'HE'S THE WORSE PRESIDENT EVER' repititions! Who are you gaging his performance against? Do you even remember REAGAN? Some even claim CARTER as bad! Were you in a coma when BUSH was in office?

    August 12, 2011 at 6:14 pm |
    • jean2009


      August 13, 2011 at 4:26 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      I just get tired of you ranting about racism... thats all

      August 15, 2011 at 1:41 am |
      • Emmet D.

        I get tired of hearing, "You're just playing the race card!" When some claim President Obama is our worst president in history (even after only a month in office), carry signs showing him as a witch doctor with a bone in his nose, call him a Tar Baby, and play songs like, "Barrack the Magic Negro"; when Obama has received more death threats than any president since Lincoln, when many of his proposals actually originated from Republicans and yet are called "socialist" and "un-American" when he supports those proposals, when his birth place was doubted in the face of overwhelming evidence, when I hear normally nice, church-going friends refuse to even call Obama "President," begs the question. If it isn't racism, what is it?

        August 27, 2011 at 10:22 pm |
  21. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Hello Haneef Shakur; I agree with you too. These clowns have proven what they really care about and it's not the everyday hardworking American, the poor, nor the middle-class. In order to hurt this PRESIDENT political life forever, and to make sure history reports him as 'A FAILED PRESIDENT', they will let this nation fall flat on it's face, IN THE DIRT! Now I know there are some valid controversial opinions out here, but most of the complaints are generic, racist anti-OBAMA rants! Talk about 3rd world!

    August 12, 2011 at 6:37 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      According to Veteran post earlier ... and it is implied ... conservatives are not american.... with that said ... I get tired of you racist anti conservatie rants ... thats all you do ... .is spew the word racist over and over and over again ... you are so single minded that you would not go out of your way to spit on a conservative to put out a fire that was set on him by another liberal,.... part of the legacy of this president will be that he mobilzed liberals just like you to hate conservatives. Period

      August 15, 2011 at 1:45 am |
  22. barnyfife

    He's frustrated !!!
    What about all of us Americans that are suffering from his disastrous policies?!!!

    August 12, 2011 at 11:02 pm |
  23. steve

    Am I the only one who has an issue with a $299 million dollar grant producing 500 jobs and $150 million for 200 jobs? That is like $600,000 invested for each job created....not sure how much that helps the economy or job market

    August 13, 2011 at 12:49 am |
  24. Ross L. Pike

    I was in the crowd for that speech and even got to shake the President's hand. It was a great speech! Does CNN have more pictures of the event, specifically of the President greeting the event's attendees?

    August 13, 2011 at 4:57 am |
    • Asma

      Yes equality and co-existence would be the utitmale goal, but the way I see it is that a group is strongest when united, when together. The immigrants who came to America first moved into the cities where people from their countries already lived. Had they not grouped together, their life would have been harder, they would have experienced more hate, more discrimination, and the china-towns' and little Italy' sections of cities would never have existed. Their cultural influence would have never become so great! we wouldn't have greasey chinese food, or cheesey pizza!!! ahhhhhhhhhhhh! imagine the horror!!

      July 30, 2012 at 9:53 pm |
  25. surf's up2010

    We are frustrated with the horrible job you are doing Obama... RESIGN!!!!

    August 13, 2011 at 6:47 am |
  26. Suz


    August 13, 2011 at 3:12 pm |
  27. Dee

    To the Veteran thanks for your service to this country with all the hatred and vitriol that I have been reading it is a shame. we all know and don't want to admit that all of this is about a man of color in the White House and we need not say don't play the race card. It is true and until we face it there is always going to be a problem in this country. You can tell from your responses who is a racist in this article.

    We very well know that there are bills held up that they will not pass only because they want him to be a one time President. Mitch McConnell said it loud and clear so we don't need to sweep this stuff under the rug. The President is trying to do a lot for the poor, middle class, elderly and the young people of this country but his hands are tired by the GOP and the wealthy who put money in their pockets.

    America we need to wake up and stop denigrating this man and be realistic to who is causing the grid lock in Washington and it is not President Obama. It you don't believe it then vote for President Bush's look alike Rick Perry and see where the country will go.

    August 14, 2011 at 1:33 am |
    • Jay in NC

      Liberals opposed the war in Afghanistan, until their own became president. Is that because of his skin color?

      August 14, 2011 at 6:10 am |
      • jean2009

        Both House and Senate approved by overwhelming vote the bill to go after Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan on September 14, 2001.

        It was George W. Bush who decided that war was going to be long and slow, and he thought an easier glorious and less costly Victory could be obtained by diverting to Iraqi....which turned out to be wrong.

        Then add the fact he didn't want to end tax cuts for his wealthy friends to pay for either war, or not allow his war profiteers to make a killing he put our credit card on the counter to pay for both. Therein is where the current problem lies.

        You people never hear...."You can have guns, or you can have butter, but you can't have both."
        When we print money to fund a destructive war we divert money from everything we can do at home, such as homes, schools, roads, and quality of life. If money is not spent for war we can fund things that havea permanent value which retain that value for many years.

        August 14, 2011 at 4:50 pm |
      • jean2009

        The last time I check this has nothing to do with President Obama's skin color....other than in your eyes. Your racism is very obvious.

        August 14, 2011 at 5:05 pm |
      • Jay in NC

        Barry extended the wars, extended the tax cuts, I guess he is as stupid as President Bush. Oh, I forgot, Liberals are hypocrites.

        August 14, 2011 at 5:11 pm |
  28. Liz Carter in Georgia

    The first thing Jay, youe firing smokescreened darts at JUST US LIBERALS everytime you open your mouth. Yet when we turn those darts back around to you brainwashed, braindead, sheep of the conservative GOP/TEAPARTY, YOU and others of your ilk like John/Bill have the audacity to whine to us to be accusatory and questioning of Republicans and Democrats. However, from reading most of your posts you all are rooting hard and loud for your conservative persuasions, as you continue to try to demean/dismiss ours!

    August 14, 2011 at 11:03 am |
    • Bill in STL

      And you don't do the same Liz? LMAO

      August 15, 2011 at 1:46 am |
  29. Liz Carter in Georgia

    The second thing Jay is, where did you get your misinformation that 'LIBERALS' opposed the war in AFGHANISTAN, insenuating we were the ONLY ones opposed to the war in AFGHANISTAN? Oh, and that was only until one of our own became president! Once again you have shown yourself as the racist person that you are. He is of an African American skin color, are all AAs liberals? Or are you saying all liberals AAs? Most 'liberals' and 'conservatives' fairly understood AFGHANISTAN since OBL was said to be there THEN!

    August 14, 2011 at 11:24 am |
    • Bill in STL

      If only you cound learn what reply means ...

      August 17, 2011 at 12:18 am |
    • Dusan

      I think these ranking numebrs aren't that important, because I write comments to a blog which is interesting for me. Why should I write comments to any informations which are not important for me? There are often people writing comments only to be on top positions on such a ranking, and i think that's stupid anyhow. I guess everybody should decide by him-/herself if these numebrs are really that important.But in business that's different, because there are numebrs a very important fact (for example: numebrs of visitors ). That shows you if your website is visited well or not. This stats shows you if you have to change something on your website.

      August 1, 2012 at 2:44 am |
  30. Liz Carter in Georgia

    The third thing Jay is, liberals black, white and other questioned the sudden greedy switch of focus away from OBL to IRAQ! Since most of you conservative sheep failed to question the irresponsible decisions of YOUR OWN, GWB, at least not so publicly, trying to 'save face' rather than Americas 'a**', YES we questioned the decision of YET another 'unfunded' war! IRAQ?!? We were already 'unfundedly' posted up in AFGHANISTAN, where we should've stayed. It was more reasonable and understandable, us being there!

    August 14, 2011 at 11:53 am |
    • Jay in NC

      Colin Powell lied, daddy died. Do not get me started about that baby killer.

      August 14, 2011 at 5:14 pm |
      • jean2009

        Colin Powell was saying Saddam had no WMD until Dick Cheney said differently.Colin Powell,
        February 2001: "[Saddam] has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors. So in effect, our policies have strengthened the security of the neighbors of Iraq."- Colin Powell

        August 15, 2011 at 5:12 am |
  31. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Bill in STL, You may have a point, but all I have to say to you and people like you is take a walk in my shoes if you dare! You wouldn't be able to begin to face, accept, nor deal with it as well as I have! You nor your kind would take it; You'd rather 'fight than switch'! You couldn't handle it; it's been proven over and over again. You need to read Jays' post of August 14, 2011 6:10 am ET before you start in on me! I was responding to his 'Is that because of his skin color'. I answered the question too!

    August 14, 2011 at 8:49 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      How do you know I haven't? that is the problem with you Liz, you think that only black people have suffered ... you are wrong.... I am a conservative and I have suffered at the hands of racists as well... but that is not the badge that I wear for all to see..... I have done well by my own blood sweat and tears, and I don't need people like you telling my how evil I am for doing it.

      Oh and here you go ... .posting miles and miles beyond where my post was again!!!!! Do you do that to try to hide what you say or is it because you don't know what reply means?

      August 15, 2011 at 1:50 am |
  32. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Bill, don't play oblivious! You know good and darn well the term 'spade' is racist! You racist really kill me trying to act like you didn't know or that it wasn't the intent. Your kind are the ones who ginned those titles up and yes! They were racially motivated. BTW, just like you, Jay and a few other 'hit dogs', who like to accuse me, Jean and a few others of....Oooops....'playing the race card' 'cons' sure do like to 'play the stupid card'! Revamp your hearts, you won't need to rephrase your words!

    August 14, 2011 at 9:10 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      Liz you are being over sensitive on this .... If the word spade was used in anyother context I migh agree with you ....

      after using that tool known as google ... I did not find any references to racism on the first pagfe at alll and as a matter of fact the last enrtry spokeof a garden tool .... so let me show you some of the hits I found.

      To speak plainly – to describe something as it really is.

      is NOT an ethnic slur.
      It derives from an ancient Greek expression: _ta syka syka, te:n
      skaphe:n de skaphe:n onomasein_ = "to call a fig a fig, a trough a
      trough". This is first recorded in Aristophanes' play _The Clouds_
      (423 B.C.), was used by Menander and Plutarch, and is still current
      in modern Greek.

      to tell the truth about something, even if it is not polite or pleasant You know me, I call a spade a spade and when I see someone behaving like an idiot, I tell them.

      Usage notes
      Sometimes mistakenly taken as derogatory from the sense of spade that refers to a black person. However those two expressions are unrelated; this refers to the digging instrument, and the other to the card suit.

      Most people know that to call a spade a spade means that we should avoid euphemism, be straightforward, use blunt or plain language

      August 15, 2011 at 1:56 am |
      • jean2009

        So far, there is no evidence that you can speak fluent I assume you are alas a racist.

        August 15, 2011 at 5:22 am |
      • jean2009

        What's does the Greek quote about figs have to do with the American slur about spades? FYI that is the lamest one I've ever heard. So, when I see someone acting like an idiot I tell them, too, and that doesn't pass this American's smell test.

        August 15, 2011 at 5:28 am |
      • Bill in STL

        Jean ..... you are such a sad excuse fora human being ... you are political party and race all the way ..... It has been a chore talking to you .... so long

        August 17, 2011 at 12:21 am |
    • Bill in STL

      So after having read the above post ... it appears that you are the racist....

      August 15, 2011 at 1:57 am |
      • C-Lo

        Give up this fight with these two. It's a waste of your time and engery. They cannot formulate a constructive argument (see Bruce above, who at least discusses the issues) so they throw the race card out to discredit anything you have, are, or will say. They get you defending yourself against their non-sequitur arguments so they don't have to argue the true issues. It's a lost cause and cannot be won against the blind followers of Kenyon Ken.

        August 15, 2011 at 12:44 pm |
      • Bill in STL

        A-men ... they remind me of a Monty Python film

        August 16, 2011 at 8:29 pm |
  33. Liz Carter in Georgia

    LOL! Sad, pathetic, weightless responses Bill and C-Lo. Oh, I see you're trying to dodge the bullet Bill, but it just hit you square in the a**, and we both know hit dogs holler don't we Jean! Don't let them bully you! Don't give them the power to boo you...that's what they want; to wind us down, and knock us off point! NO WAY...And you need to give it up don't fool manybody....we will call it out everytime we see or hear it! Flipping the script won't get it either OK? OK. Next subject!

    August 16, 2011 at 11:50 pm |
    • Bill in STL

      And liberals lie ..... just like you Liz. you and jean are very sad people ... I asked you and jean to nbot take my word for it and do a google search... In true liberal racist fashion you did not and continue to blame me .... Frankly what you say is nothing more than party line tripe... you do not have enough intellegence between the two of you to to fill a thimble half way full....

      Just like I told jean, it has been a chore talking to you .... so long

      To the other liberals .... if a conservative behaved that badly I would be embarrased ... I have posted to trolls on the conservative side when they do the same as Liz anf Jean .... I have poked at them to get them to tone it down ...

      Do any of you have that ability or do you realize that no matter who says what Jean and Liz will call you a racist.... LOL

      August 17, 2011 at 12:27 am |
    • C-Lo

      Liz, come on. Don't tell me you're that obtuse. This comment is exactly what we've been trying to communicate to the two of you (and others). We are not going to be bullied by YOU into criticizing the pres just because he's black and any criticizm is immediately labled as racist by you and your ilk. Again, I point to Bruce above, a self proclaimed progressive who enters into a discussion based on ideology and not emotion (though the two can feed off each other). The more you and Jean sit around and scream "racism" the less time you take to discuss the actual issues. And it is therefore my conclusion, as I said before, that you have no true defense of BO's policies, you can only defend him by "hittin' the dogs" (are you any relation to Michael Vick with comments like that?) So, like Bill in STL, I wish you and Jean a fond farewell. When you you decide you want to discuss the underlying policies and not just skin color, maybe we could have a civil discussion. But then again, I doubt it.

      August 18, 2011 at 9:46 am |
  34. Liz Carter in Georgia

    @C-lo and @Bill in STL, are YOU two feeding off of one another? Are you two going to sit up there and accuse Jean2009 of not discussing or debating REAL issues? Giving her own opinions of experience, wisdom, and knowledge of their outcomes? Many times producing names of people, dates, codes, bills, places & events, pulled, cut & pasted from your beloved internet, so you won't claim she made it up; nor turn around and call her a LIAR, requesting she show you proof of the basis of her opinions or positions?

    August 18, 2011 at 11:00 am |
    • C-Lo

      1. So once again you go back to the finger pointing and "hiding" behind Jean...if you are smart enough to sit around and post all day, certainly you are smart enough to look up and study some of this history yourself (plus some civics/economics?)
      2. Where exactly did I call Jean a liar?
      3. The only "valid" names/dates/times...I found here are her 1st post, which were weak to begin with.
      1. Bush and the Republicans had to keep the country from sinking after the worst attack against us since Pearl Harbor, one that struck at the heart of our financial system (like it or not)
      2. Many of Bush's failed policies were actually very liberal in nature–No Child Left Behind, Home Ownership for all initiatives, etc.
      3. The wars were voted on, approved and funded overwhelmingly by the Congress, time and again. Even after 2006 takeover by Dems
      4. WMD evidence was actually heavily supplied and backed by the Brits (why do you think Tony Blair was such a staunch supporter of our efforts) because Clinton had so drastically cut our intelligence agencies. To continue on with this, that was due to the peace dividend brought about by the end of the Cold War thanks to Reagan. If Bush had "lied" about the WMD's (which were 1 of about 20 reasons, 23 by some counts, outlined for our invasion of Iraq) we would have "found" more evidence, don't you think?
      5. Obama didn't "get" bin Laden, it was US inteligence and a SEAL team, Obama simply sat behind a desk (or in front of closed circut tv) and ordered the hit. I am not diminishing the accomplishment, or his courage in acting on it, but it does not make him the hero you all want. As a matter of fact, if I wanted to push the matter as much as you all did with Bush, he's a villian for invading a country's borders without their permission–which upset them so much they may have allowed our newest "enemy" to review sensitive technology on the downed chopper.
      6. I have said elsewhere that just because Bush fanned an economic grease fire that's been burning for decades, we don't need Obama throwing water on it while his blinded by loyalty minions stand behind him handing him buckets of water any more than what happed with parts of the Bush admin.
      7 The 2008 TARP was passed by a Dem congress, who holds the country's purse strings and has been dealing blow after blow since Dems took over in 2006. Yes, Bush had veto power, but he can only sign or veto bills that are initially passed by congress.

      So, if you want to debate these points I'd be happy to, but I am not going to play your game of run and shut up because you call me a racist for criticizing the pres.

      August 18, 2011 at 11:44 am |
  35. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Jean2009 produces a wealth of information to us ALL on this blog about ANY particular issue you guys claim to want to discuss! I'm a 'blog student' of hers myself! I know she's more well-read in results of REAL political watching, past and present, than I! It's just not what YOU and others of your ILK want to hear. It doesn't reflect your obvious ongoing, beligerent, negative opinion of this President, his administration and what they're genuinely trying to accomplish in WASHINGTON for the American People!

    August 18, 2011 at 11:18 am |
    • C-Lo

      Then as a "sudent" learn how to research and not just sit around hurling unfounded insults every chance you get. And as Reagan said, "Trust but verify."
      I am going to make an assumption about you, Liz, and I truly hope you don't take offence if it is wrong, but I believe by posts of yours I've read, you are an African American. I am assuming "in Georga" means the state and not some city I'm not aware of. So putting two and two together, racist, regionalist or whatever you want to call it, there is a high probability that you are a Christian, or if not, at least familiar with the Bible. My point being (after all of that) is that if this is the case, you are familar with the way information in the Bible has been taken out of context for years. Take some of Jean's comments, investigate and put on "conservative" glasses to see how they look. It may be eye opening for you.

      I honestly hope you learn something more than spouting off bumper sticker slogans. If after doing so, you still feel the way you do then all the best. But hopefully you will see that we at least have valid disagreements with BO's policies based on how we belienve DC should be run...not because of his skin color.

      August 18, 2011 at 12:00 pm |
  36. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Jean2009 does so discuss the underlying issues of Americas' problems! She is not all about just the color of his skin, OK? She goes there only when the blind can see it! Jean's a white woman herself, she's just honest when writing on the wall fails, and she sees it. You guys don't care to even APPEAR to come to an understanding, compromise nor agree EVER with her opinions, even if she's proved them to be factually based! Most of it seems to be rooted in pure disdain for her; she's a PROUD OBAMA supporter.

    August 18, 2011 at 11:48 am |
    • C-Lo

      But Liz, she is myopic in her finger pointing and bush bashing...not to "factually based" is a slippery slope in this arena, Liz. I beg you to learn both philosophies of the different topics. Just throwing around "teabagger" and racist does nothing to stregthen your arguments. What you see on these posts, from Jean, Bill, myself or most others, should be considered in its context. Soundbytes are fun, and to an extent this shouldn't be considered the end source of your political education any more than the lottery should be considered the end source of your retirement. You, for what ever reason, have found Jean as a mentor in these issues, if you only took classes from one teacher throughout school, how would you ever learn to think critically about the issues? You'd have one view point to go on, right or wrong.

      August 18, 2011 at 12:11 pm |
      • Chitra

        Hey sweetie! I just looekd Liz Clark up on YouTube.. Who's Your Angel is posted there a couple of times. She has a beautiful voice and is EXACTLY my style. I love her little earrings in the beginning of the video. I'll definitely consider getting her CD. I'm always up for looking into new music. Thanks for the heads up!

        July 30, 2012 at 11:21 pm |
      • Jose

        thanks stppoing by and for your kind comment.@Enkay I think numbers have some value, as they can drive how much someone will pay for an ad! And, they can be an indicator of general performance. But, in the end, they can't tell the whole story. That was my main point.@Dan thanks very much. I wasn't putting myself down at all, just looking at things realistically. I know that part of the reason I have a high page rank is because I've released several WP themes. While it's great that many people use them and keep the link in the footer, in the end, a link to something I've written means a little more to me.

        August 1, 2012 at 5:10 am |
  37. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Now, I felt the need to defend Jeans' character and position on this blog, because I know words have power and you all have tried to diminish all of her wealth of political educational input down to being a 'Racism Identifier' ONLY! No way is that her primary focus nor modus operendi! She 'very seldom' calls it out! Whether she feels the need to even address or acknowledge your attempts at diminishing her true blog character of your false accusations against her, I will denounce and I will deny that myself!

    August 18, 2011 at 12:25 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Perhaps you are jumping on the wrong train, backing the losing team (I'm from Denver, believe me, I know a lot about losing teams, at least in sports 🙂 ). If you want a liberal ideolog to be mentored by, maybe follow Bruce from above, as I said before...see the discussion between him, Forrest, and myself. That's an ideological discussion, not an emotional one. And what the heck...I'll throw it out there, maybe it gets emotional because your women. (Calm down it was tounge in cheek to highlight all of the stereotyping, but have fun with it).

      August 18, 2011 at 12:44 pm |
    • joe

      Obama the clown cares only about being relected
      once Reelected (God Forbid) he will really screw us over

      August 18, 2011 at 12:45 pm |
    • C-Lo

      And by the way, you shouldn't feel the need to defend her character, she seems to be able to handle that herself. Also, I want you to google "barstool economics" and read the situation laid out there, this defines a PORTION of the conservative mindset. again scratching the surface, and you can also read the rebutles. DailyKos will give you a good dose of liberalism on the topic, but hopefuly it's a starting poiint.

      August 18, 2011 at 12:53 pm |
  38. joe

    Obama the Clown
    will say anything to get reelected (God Forbid)

    August 18, 2011 at 12:51 pm |
  39. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo and Bill in STL, as far as you denouncing me as just an 'obtuse' person, who turns all 'Bo's policies and problem issues and complaints into a race fight...well, I'll accept that! Although I know I've put forth many opinions of defense for many of the policies and decisions he's made over these past 2 years! However, when it comes to the perpetual battering of this President on issues that I've seen many past ones get away with, with little or no obstruction, YES! I do often associate that to racism!

    August 18, 2011 at 12:51 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Thanks Liz, you are a little less "obtuse" now 🙂 and I can, hopefully, take future comments a little more seriously. I understand, can't directly relate, but undertand, how your perception of the world has been skewed by your experiences. But if you have the courage to admit this and the self reflection you've appeared to show, then you should have the courage to stand on your own two feet. Almost no issue in politics is black and white, figuratively or literally.

      Many/most of the "obstructions" aimed at this pres are idiological, and to paint most of them with the broad brush of racism isn't fair. The reason for the obstruction come down, in my opinion, to a couple simple facts about him:
      1. He is viewd as one of the most liberal presidents we've ever had, particularly the perception that he laid out during his campaing. Downfall with conservatives.
      2. He is not nearly as liberal as the leftest wacos want(ed) him to be. Therefore some of the obstructionist come from his own party.
      3. He was not prepared for this office, love him as you may. I think it's sad that a lot of people voted FOR him because of his skin color. Colin Powell, for whom I have the UTMOST respect, said as much. He endorsed him because he didn't think he would, in his lifetime, see a black president. IMHO racism (the negative kind, i.e. not voting for him because he's black) is what got him elected, as the country was out to prove we are not a racist nation. I mean, let's be honest Liz, a junior senator without military background rising to that level that fast. It's sad that we feel so ashamed of our history that we were willing to compromise ourselves over guilt. I'm not saying he's not intelligent, but he doesn't have the leadership qualities we need in that position. I'm sure he, along with a bunch of his minions, believed that the historical significance of his making the presidency would be enough to propel him with overwhelming support in anything he did. BIG mistake. Does this make sense?

      August 18, 2011 at 1:23 pm |
  40. Liz Carter in Georgia

    This just for your information, if you are really concerned and wondering why I am sensitive to the effects, as well as knowledgeable of the touch and smell of the possibility and probabilty that racism still abounds, I'm a southern girl; born, raised, educated, worked, retired and still live in the SOUTH. I know how it looks; I know the double-standards of its petrusion; whether it be covert or overt! Whether it be acknowledged or denied; whether it be lodged against me or someone else. EVER ABOLISHED? NO!

    August 18, 2011 at 1:24 pm |
    • C-Lo

      And Liz, that gives you reason but not excuse. I feel bad for you but not sorry. Yes it's ugly, but it's not the motivator for the vast majority of "us." Again, use this information, understand how it slants your view, then step back and think objectively about the arguments put forth, rather than emotionally. Bill, I think, accused you of being overly sensitive. Maybe you are, maybe not, that's for you to figure out. I would ask that even if you don't feel you are, that you try to look at comments from another's point of view. The "tar-baby" comment by Rep Lambourne is an example. I don't believe he meant it in any overt or coverty racist way–it's not as 'outdated" in some parts of the country as others. Yes, it was an unfortunate use in this environment and he should have thought twice about using it, but it was to a local audience, I think, that normally wouldn't see it in the same light as you. All I am trying to say is that if you don't normally think in racist terms, otherwise normal conversation, i.e. calling a spade a spade, doesn't even cross one's mind as racist. Now if Lambourne had kicked into a southern accent and said "now that there president, he done be a tar baby," then skewer him. tar and feather him, waterbord him. So again I ask you to look through the view of others as they ought to consider why you stand where you do.

      August 18, 2011 at 2:02 pm |
      • Jay in NC

        In the past Liz has also used racist terms. Like the time she said that black men work harder than white men. That the phrase red-headed step-child was OK. She is a hypocrite.

        August 18, 2011 at 2:14 pm |
      • C-Lo

        Maybe so Jay. (well not maybe so, I saw it), but on the same token, if we de-escilate and show her the falacies, then hopefully she'll take some time to educate herself on the issues and start debating so she can understand the harm of this pres' policies to her and others. She speaks from emotion as I've said before which needs to stop (and she's not the only one). It's the only way to start bringing some political intellect to these boards.

        August 18, 2011 at 2:22 pm |
  41. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; Thank you for your dissertation to me. You got an A for personal specificity of how you view the political world and the world in general, from where you sit. Thank you for finding me less obtuse, yea! However, talk about pointing fingers and calling names! I CHOSE to defend Jean because I may have played a part in drawing her into the 'toilet of racism' from one of my posts a long time ago, as I was being approached nastily about my opinion from a poster, who eventually PROVED and claimed his racism!

    August 18, 2011 at 1:59 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Sorry, wasn't meant to be a dissertation!

      August 18, 2011 at 2:05 pm |
  42. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Research? I KNOW how to research. I fit most of your description of me. One description you neglected to list is that I might have had a college degree! I wonder why that is? Was it because of all of the other descriptions you percieved me to be and where I was from? You see how easy it is to stereotype or prepare yourself to accept or percieve mentally one thing, when it's not the complete story; or not IT at all? I've found that I can learn from people! I studied people. God gave me discernment of spirit.

    August 18, 2011 at 2:23 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Then Liz, I made an "educated guess" not based on my other assumptions, but because you have not shown any aptitude for researching to formulate your political arguments. I didn't mean to "push that button," but you said yourself that you are essentially an understudy of Jean, and if you'd take the time to slyly accuse me this way, then please also take the time to re-read August 18, 2011 at 12:11 pm where I am just as accusatory of you HAVING recieved a decent education and asking you to think critically (not be critical, two very different things) about the issues. Please stop trying to bring it back in this way, I have already conceded your point of standing in the position you do, have I not?

      August 18, 2011 at 2:35 pm |
  43. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; BTW, I have no reason to hide behind anybody on this blog or anywhere else! I use my name! I've never been that little scary African American girl! The mealy-mouthed one who's afraid of her own shadow; even though I came up in the struggle of the 'civil rights movement'; neither was my mother, who is 94 years old, nor her mother before her, OK? I was taught that if I didn't 'stand' for something, I would 'fall' for anything! Oh, I had a few falls anyway, but I learned greater lessons because them.

    August 18, 2011 at 2:48 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Ok, again Liz, calm down. "Hiding behind Jean" was a figuratively speaking regarding her arguments because you are not "standing for something" in your posts with regard to political arguments. Again, I appreciate your life's lessons and where you are coming from in terms of "racism," but I had hoped we had come to some sort of understanding about where things stood here, and that you might research some of this and we could have a discussion about those issues, but you continue to waste time going in circles on these implications. We cannot have a serious discussion about the politics if you insist on nit-picking every sentence to death.

      August 18, 2011 at 3:36 pm |
  44. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; You see how quick and deliberate you went into trying justify the 'failed policies' of the BUSH administration saying they had to save the nations' financial system of the worse attack since Pearl Harbor? When we try to defend the decisions OBAMA of trying to make to 'save' the STILL failing economy due to the 'failed policies' of the BUSH administration, all hell breaks loose among conservatives! It looks to us like they're too busy trying to blame the WHOLE FAILURE on him; It's OBAMAS' fault alone!

    August 18, 2011 at 3:26 pm |
    • Forrest

      Sorry Liz I have only watched your talks in the past little bit and not participated in them.

      So lets talk about 'Bush's' failed policies. Please choose one and we will discuss it. Please enumerate these failures so we can discuss them. I happen to know several policy issues that I highly disagreed with, of course they more than likely are not the ones you disagree with so please lets go over a few 'failed' policies and discuss them.

      August 18, 2011 at 3:50 pm |
      • C-Lo

        Don't know if she's ready for that type of in-depth discussion yet (as it appears from her statements she hasn't done much research on cause/effect of policies). And this isn't meant as an affront to you Liz. I am hopeful that Liz is now more focused on this and can and will challenge us on the political issues. She seems to be interested in this focus now that we've "cleared the air a little." Hope I'm wrong, and we can go deeper than this!

        August 18, 2011 at 5:24 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Thank you (sincerely) for bringing this into the dicsussion, and that's just it, Liz, the immediate reaction, fiscally, of the Bush/republican policies after 9/11 propped up a nation after a military attack. Arguably we as a people put down our relatively minor differences to stand against a common enemy/threat. Now what's happened since 01/02 has more relevancy for debate, in my opinion. I do think Bush failed on several fronts, as I've pointed out before, and am not necessarily a Bush appologist, as someone else so eloquently put it. But I place most of the blame on the failings of a Democratically controlled congress. Liz, if you look at the coveted healthcare law as an example, it is little more than taxpayers subsidizing big insurance, the very thing Dems demonize. Pelosi herself said "we'll just have to pass it so you can see what's in it." They had 2 years of TOTAL control from 08-10. Why didn't they pass a budget? Why, if Bush's tax cuts were so evil, did Obama agree to an extension? He postured during the debt ceiling debates, but not for the tax extension. And please don't use the "he was held hostage by the terrorist tea party." his actions on one contradicted his actions on the other, which again, points to a lack of leadership. He's in way over his head (and that may have held true for anyone else who walked in in 08, we'll never really know). The bad policies during the latter part of Bush's presidency (agian in my opinion a result of dem congress) are being exacerbated now.

      He's even talking about MORE tax cuts and stimulus after the bitter failure of his original stimulus. Take some time to look at where the orginal stimulus money went that was supposed to spur economic activity. Less than $1B of the nearly $800B went to businesses. It was almost all in gov't programs. Keynsian economics that can now be shown not to work. And remember his "shovel ready projects that weren't as shovel ready as we thought." Joking or not, it's epidemic of his policies.

      August 18, 2011 at 4:27 pm |
      • Forrest

        Add onto the fact that we had started moving into a recession in late 2000 that bloomed into a reality right about the time 9/11 even occurred The rich ( whom the left enjoys lambasting so much ) went from making $1.7 Trillion dollars in the year 2000, to making only $1.38 Trillion in 2001. The reason Clinton was able to even begin to pay down the deficit was partially because the Rich had managed to make so much in 1999 and 2000. Bush had to contend with the bubble which burst do to the economic acceleration during the last four years of the Clinton administration.!

        August 18, 2011 at 5:40 pm |
  45. Liz Carter in Georgia

    You all can't have it both ways! The economy is OBAMAS', not the responsibility of the government, the oilspill, fires and floods are OBAMAS', not the responsibility of the US government! You all hurried up and said that the wars BUSH/CHENEY started, were now OBAMAS' wars! Why? He's President now! However, when OBL got caught and killed under his watch, NOT HIM! He can't enjoy any of that credit! He was just sitting behind his desk! Where do you think BUSH would've been had he kept his promise and got him?

    August 18, 2011 at 3:51 pm |
    • C-Lo

      LIz, did you read the rest of the comment on OBL? I was merely pointing out the fact that it wasn't Obama who got him, and I even went on to crediting him with having the b@lls to order the attack. RE: the economy, I'm not trying to hav it both ways, I have said that I believe his policies, particularly when coupled with a dem congress have exacerbated the issues not tempered them.

      August 18, 2011 at 4:33 pm |
    • C-Lo

      PS thank you for keeping this discussion on topic. I don't mind you disagreeing along these lines, it give me a chance to review my own thoughts on the topics.

      August 18, 2011 at 4:37 pm |
      • Mahbubnagar

        and I am glad to see others feel the same as I do. Recently I was paapciitrting in a conversation on one of the listservs I am on. As happens from time to time, a thread on blogging and websites is created and people engage in that conversation. And as usually happens, talk of stats, numbers, outbound and inbound linking becomes the focus of the thread.I agree that the influence is important and right along with that is the conversation and relationships one builds by blogging. Instead of being so focused on the numbers, bloggers should also be more concerned with turning visitors into readers. And more important, return readers. It are these readers that we build a relationship with.

        August 1, 2012 at 5:53 am |
  46. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; A few of the items you listed about Bushs' BIG plight in office are qute simular to OBAMAS' plight. Pres OBAMA can only sign or veto bills that are actually passed by Congress too! Yet, after all the obstructive treasonous behavior that goes on in Washington in Congress EVERYDAY since the man's been in office, from corrupted GOP conservatives and Blue Dog Democrats (really Republicans) or should I say weak, bought-out Democrats still scream at him! It's ALL his fault! How's that for balanced views?

    August 18, 2011 at 4:45 pm |
    • C-Lo

      So if 60 FRESHMEN congressmen(women) can hold an etire party hostage, as the left claimed, why could't Obama get a majority in his party to walk lock-step during those two years, especially after having what he deemed a mandate from the people to expand ulta liberal views?
      And you're right, a lot of BO's plights can be viewed as similar to GW's. So let's compare and contrast these select few (feel free to add any others you'd like to contemplate):
      1. Katrina vs. Mid West flooding–GW acted as soon as the governor "approved" it, respecting (right or wrong the 10th amendment). A lot of towns, fully destroyed are still waiting for aid approval in the mid west (some will never see it)
      2. 9/11 vs. gulf oil spill–GW rallied America, BO did more foot stomping...this is admittedly a stretch and would entail more than I have the desire to type right now
      3. Economy–GW/repubs nursed it back after 9/11, Dems pushd it back starting around 07 (busines fears of major policy changes) and BO w/dem congress put a stake in the heart with healthcare and fear of other huge costs of doing business.

      Also to be fair, there are a lot of "issues" outside of what we peons ever realize, but if you have a penchant for reading, pick up "Web of Debt" that discusses the Fed Reserve and it's influence (hypothetically) on the world economies and policies.

      August 18, 2011 at 5:15 pm |
  47. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; Just know, I believe I satisfy myself with enough research to form a pretty reasonable opinion on most of political issues. I read the papers, I read the whitehouse blog threads, posters opinions, I watch CSPAN 1 and 2, I watch all of XFINITYs' cable news outlets, including CNN, CNBC, FOX, MSNBC. That's enough for me. When I feel the need to go into the WEB, I do! Yes, I 'stand for something', when it comes to my opinion, until I learn for sure that I'm wrong; usually from those same resources! OK?

    August 18, 2011 at 5:29 pm |
    • Forrest


      You are talking about Pundits, who despite 'reporting' the news often times do not give you enough information to be able to understand underlying concepts necessary to actually understand the underlying concepts. In other words the WORST place you can go in order to help you form opinion are the very sites you mention. Especially if you take an attitude in which you attack rather than attempt to understand. Debate is GOOD, even if you are wrong ( which I may well be ) as it helps vet the facts and allows reflection about things that you may not have known or understood before. The other thing I HATE is simply accepting sound bites. For instance "corrupt GOP conservatives"

      Okay, that is great, could it be that rather than being corrupt they have a different view point on the economy and how to best serve it? I actually think Obama is trying to do the right thing, at least most of the time he is. He is even correct that tax increases as well as spending cuts are needed to balance the budget in short order. Do you know WHY Republicans are against that idea? It actually has to do with history that has occurred over the last 30 years.

      I would suggest that had Obama been willing to cut first and then come to the negotiating table on raising taxes there would have been many more people willing to meet 'half way' but again this is due to historical understanding that I know about that I do not think you do.

      Name calling does not help either, and don't get me wrong MANY 'conservatives' do it as well, I tell them the same thing I tell you, simply calling someone a name is not conducive to creating understanding, without understanding there can be no middle ground.

      August 18, 2011 at 5:50 pm |
  48. Liz Carter in Georgia

    I'm a retired person so I got time to watch the news outlets, post comments on the blog as I take care my mother who has alzheimers. Figuratively speaking? Sorry! It looked serious to me. I thought you were serious! Oh, one more thing; I'm not just a bumper sticker 'quoting' person...I didn't even have one on my car in 2007-2008, nor do I have one now! To the question asked me about why OBAMA extended the Bush taxcuts for two more years, he didn't want to hurt the 250Kers, while they're already hurting!!

    August 18, 2011 at 5:49 pm |
  49. Forrest

    Now take for instance the concept of 'Food Stamps' or as it is now know SNAP which has recently come out on the news. The Agriculture secretary has come out and said that the monetary acceleration of this kind of stimulus is $1.84 ( though many put it at $1.72 )

    I have an issue with this. First the number is not based on 'Food Stamp' money, but rather on grocery spending in general. Second, the purpose behind this form of stimulus is not to allow for food purchase, which in and of itself is ironic, but rather to allow more of a persons money to go towards everything BUT food purchasing.

    Lastly I have an issue with the way the government actually administers the program as it creates Income Stop Gaps. For my Family of seven ( yes we are plentiful in our house ) the stop gap is $12,000.00. That means that if I hit the threshold I have to make an additional $12,000 before it is worth it for me to get off of food stamps. This may seem like a small thing but I do not believe people are stupid and will make sure unless they are offered more than $12,000 that they stay well below the threshold level that would cause a change in that monetary allowance.

    Anyway, my point in saying all of this is that the noble concept of feeding people, which is what the goal behind SNAP is also creates, because the government does it, a number of other issues that are difficult to 'fix. Also the problem with most facts and figures is that they are correct ( btw the main reason that food stimulus is so effective is that unlike manufactured goods the money stays in the United States thereby creating a much greater economic multiplier effect than other forms of stimulus ) but as people WOULD have to eat either way... Is it a stimulus for food or simply an offset of funding that causes people to spend their money on manufactured goods rather than 'food'? I honestly do not know I am simply asking a question.

    I also think C-Lo meant that you are saying platitudes rather than following it up with substance, not that you have bumper stickers on your car.

    August 18, 2011 at 6:06 pm |
  50. Liz Carter in Georgia

    They aren't all WARREN BUFFETS! Many of them have lost their jobs, insurance, houses, cars, and their total ways of lives! So to keep from hurting them anymore than they are already, the WARREN BUFFETS have to ride with the taxcuts a little while longer, until OBAMA can get a jobs bill initiative passed in the CONGRESS that could potentially eliminate much more pain FIRST! That's why I believe the GOP doesn't REALLY want the economy or a jobs plan activated! Many of them and their 'consitits' are BUFFETS!

    August 18, 2011 at 6:13 pm |
  51. Liz Carter in Georgia

    You're welcome. I will try to appease your request that I keep to your topic as long or as much as I can, but as soon as I see a double-standard evolving, or what to me looks and feels like one, I will address it. Thankyou for seemingly to accept and understand my views on lifes' experiences with the ELEPHANT that's still hiding in plain sight, in the rooms of the American moral system; after all that has happened, all of these years, after all of the minority lives lost in war, in the name of patriotism!

    August 18, 2011 at 6:34 pm |
  52. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; I made those comments in a heated as you say an emotional back and forth that I know was race-baited and biased. Yes, I did say black men worked harder than white men in most areas, most labor jobs (especially in the South where I see it) and that I believed that the 'system' was expecting OBAMA to follow suit! I mentioned that he caved in a few areas to the GOP and they still treated him like a red-headed stepchild. RACIST? Jay is a blog troublemaker, racist-bigot and I believe he hates women.

    August 18, 2011 at 7:48 pm |
    • C-Lo

      Liz, I think you're partially right about Jay, reading some of his posts, but my guess is he does it to get a rise outa people, makes him happy.
      I don't want you to think Forrest and I are trying to gang up on you over these issues, but to try to educate you on what the majority on our side really think and why, not what Fox, MSNBC try to pass for news, they are more concerned with ad $$. As Forrest said, they are pundents. I'm glad you say you are not totally up on the ins and outs of political banter, and I agree you have a right, edcated on it or not, to have an opinion. Recognizing that within yourself, take the time to read some books outside of the noise so you can make truly informed decisions, not these soundbyte arguments we get from TV.

      I wish you and your mother well (God bless her, 94?!! wow).

      August 19, 2011 at 9:52 am |
  53. Liz Carter in Georgia

    Now let me be clear, I'm not trying to play DEVILS ADVOCATE with 2 or 3 of you at a time! The posts are overlapping and they show up late on my screen. Forrest, I respect your opinion as it stands. I don't care to play whose right and whose wrong games with 3 and 4 people all at once. I mentioned long ago on this same thread that I did not profess to be totally up on the ins and outs of political banter and that I was not a politician! I don't have to go to school to have an opinion either! C-lo, thanks!

    August 18, 2011 at 8:16 pm |
  54. Liz Carter in Georgia

    C-lo; I'm sorry I'm just responding to your last post but, I was out all day today. I do thank you for your blessing to us from GOD.

    August 19, 2011 at 11:38 pm |
  55. Brandy

    Did anyone else hear what Cantor said? He said he rather people do without jobs than to give money to the economy.
    He doesnt have to worry about a paycheck or a mortgae or food on the table. Put him in the position many Americans are in and see if he can survive.

    August 28, 2011 at 5:20 pm |
  56. truthwinz

    To paraphrase what you said to John McCain. "you won" – and things have gotten nothing but worse since. You own this. You wanted the job. You proclaimed victory and with that you took resposibility.
    We don't care how frustrated you are. There are millions of frustrated Americans out of work and unable to find a job. Realtors and other self employed independant contractors are struggling and don't even show up in the employment numbers. Social Security recipients havent had a COLA in several years. Home sellers are bordering on bankruptcy and foreclosure.
    Stop whining and do your job.

    September 2, 2011 at 7:50 pm |
  57. Timberwolf Six

    All I know is the Republicans better find someone likable and electable to run for President because you are scraping the bottom of the barrel to run against a popular president. Those who do not think he is popular better wise up. His approval rating is twice that of your last Republican idiot who got us into this mess. People are not going to forget what things were like during the previous administration and people are not going to forget that a Republican congress that ran on a lack of jobs has not authored one bill to create a single job. So quit embarrasing yourselves with Perry, Palin, Romney, and Bachmann. I am sure the Republicans have their own version of hope out there but these aforementioned four bring none of that. This country needs hope, ideas and action not just criticism which is all I have heard from the right in the last three years. I have not heard one original thought. Only the same garbage Bush rammed down our throat, the same crap that destroyed a nation.

    September 8, 2011 at 7:49 am |